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ARTICLE SUMMARY
Families foot bill for council pensionsGOLD-PLATED pensions for town hall staff swallow up one pound out of every five paid in council tax, shocking new figures revealed last night. Pages: 1 
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I'M ALRIGHT JACK
28.09.09, 7:35pm
it should be invested in private sector pension schemes and then that would be fair pay what you want into the scheme and no more thieving off ordinary tax payers for the rest off your lives taxes should go towards essential services not for the people themselves councils and government have been very generous with other peoples money we could start with charging for parking every one who works in town has to pay so you lot should do as well then no more full pay for taking days off willy nilly you should only receive ssp
• Posted by: patty000 • Report Comment
FAMILES FOOT THE BILL
28.09.09, 2:49pm
I must add to my previous post.
I find it very hard to believe the figures presented by the TPA and they possibly suffer from "there are lies,damned lies, and statistics".
It may well be that 20% of Council Tax goes to pensions but let's put it into context. About 75% of Local Authority income comes from Government Grants. (that is from general taxes). Only 25% comes from Council Tax.
So that means that in fact the pension proportion of TOTAL Local Authority expenditure is actually about 5% (20% of 25% = 5%).
Most of LA expenditure goes on salaries but not all and LA's pay MORE than 5% of employee salaries into the pension fund so it may be that 1/5 of Council Tax goes to pensions. Is that any different from the "pension premium" paid WITHIN the consumer cost of goods where the supplier maintains a pension scheme - of which the consumer is never told? I don't think so.
The TPA argument is hence redundant and the Express should be ASHAMED of presenting such an ill researched story as its main headline.
As for "gold plated". I wish.
• Posted by: Bewick • Report Comment
FAMILIES FOOT BILL FOR COUNCIL PENSIONS
28.09.09, 2:06pm
The article is at best misleading and I could equally claim that "the insured foot the bill for Insurance Industry Pensions"
I have respect for the TPA but did object some time ago to similar claims from them. They chose not to publish me - a common response if someone objects.
I spent a career in Local Government starting 1962. For year after year after year we received LESS than the average pay-rise for the private sector. The reason ALWAYS stated was that we had jobs for life and a very good pension scheme.
Well guess what? I was made redundant from a very senior post after 28 years service. So much for that argument then! I used my management consultancy skills - note LG ditched most of its internal consultants about 1990 and now pay high prices for commercial providers - and went freelance.
I did projects for the Government and the insurance industry mainly. The Insurance Industry had an even better pension scheme than LG and was largely "unfunded". On a job for job basis their qualified staff were paid salaries about 50% more than they would have been paid in LG so attracted even better pensions quite apart from the 1/60 per year of service v 1/80.Your insurance premiums still pay for that but I see no cries against it.
The Civil servants (and the Treasury STARTED management consultancy during WW2) were untrained and unqualified. The Civil Service pension scheme USED to be unfunded so was, and probably is, funded from taxes..
A further issue is that Local Authorities took "payment hoildays" during the good times. That is when the pension fund was awash with money the Local Authorities didn't bother paying in their contributions.
I fully accept that SOME very senior Local Govt staff are now receiving excessive salaries - which once was not the case and the balance has tipped - but only for some. As in the City and elsewhere (and I used to do exactly this) if it is argued that "we need to pay more to keep them" then the response is "suck it and see". I'll guarantee that few if any will actually leave. Where would they go?
I suggest that the Express do some REAL research before accepting the word of the TPA (a pressure group) or anyone else.
• Posted by: Bewick • Report Comment
WHAT IS 'PUBLIC SECTOR'?
28.09.09, 11:37am
You seem to be confusing public sector workers with old-fashioned 'civil servants'. People in the very front line of Public Service, Ambulance staff, health professionals etc are included in the union comments. Our lifestyle is greatly reduced by the fact that my husband has dedicated his life to working for the Ambulance Service. His salary is shockingly low for what he deals with, and i have to work to ensure a decent standard of living for our family. Why should he not receive a pension, that by the way on average is drawn on for a very short period, after a life of penny piching and hard work for little thanks, that allows a few years of pleasure after all we have given up to provide a vital service for our fellow citizens?
Stop generalising, and remember that not all 'Public Sector' workers sit in offices shuffelling pointless paperwork. Campaign to weed out all the wasted staff that wander aimlessly around Town Halls and Hospitals rather than sticking the boot in to real workers that many people in this country can thank for their lives and well being.
• Posted by: sp12 • Report Comment
FAMILIES FOOT THE BILL FOR COUNCIL PENSIONS
28.09.09, 11:11am
the figures speak for themselves ,we have civil servants in this country that are retiring at 60 with nice fat pensions ,whilst the ordinary worker is having to work over 65 ,just to make ends meet .in my local paper ,the jobs section is always advertising jobs for council employees ,with generous wages and good pensions ,the car parks are full at the council offices and spilling over on to the streets.yet if the public ask for anything ,roadsafety for outside our schools ,new surfaces for accident hotspots ,we are told there is no money left in the budget,council employees are living off the money ,that is designated for public roads ,schools ,etc .the services have declined in most areas ,where the staff in council offices has rissen ,it doesnt take long to realise why our sevices are failing and why the councils have introduced fines for wheelie bins etc ,they can not carry on at this rate a reduction in staff will have to come into force ,but just imagine how many million that will cost us .we would all like our snouts in the trough ,but some of us have to go out and work for every thing we have ,and pay huge amounts of taxes to keep the pigs in jobs.
• Posted by: crazyhorse • Report Comment
£28K PENSION
28.09.09, 10:41am
To quote the PCS union website:
The IDS findings on the eve of this year’s TUC conference come as employer led organisations attempt to portray civil and public servants as ‘having it easy’ compared to the private sector.
The myth is far from the reality with the average pension for civil servants amounting to £6,500 and dropping to £4,200 once high earners are excluded.
Nearly 100,000 civil and public service jobs have gone over the last 5 years and more than half of the civil service earn less than the UK national wage.
Commenting, Mark Serwotka, PCS general secretary, said: "These findings expose the myth that civil servants enjoy better rates of pay than the private sector.
"The notion that dedicated civil servants who do everything from helping people back to work, to tax credits and passports have it easy is false. Civil service pay has increased at a slower rate than the private sector.
"Over 100,000 civil servants earn less than £15,000 with 40% of jobcentre workers getting no pay rise at all last year. PCS members like other low paid workers continue to bear the brunt of the recession in terms of pay.
"Divisive myths about pay, pensions and job security should not be used as a pretext to freeze pay, cut pensions and lay waste to civil and public services.
"Job cuts, low pay and an average pension of £4,200 are the realities for the people who keep this country running. The government needs to see through the divisive myths about civil and public servants and to recognise the important role they play in delivering vital services."
So just who does get this £28K pension then?
I suggest the DE enlighten us or else we'll believe that these figures are plucked out of nowhere to turn people against Public Sector workers so that they get no sympathy from the general public when the Govt. lay waste to their livelihoods.
• Posted by: jonocynic9 • Report Comment
I WONDER...............
28.09.09, 8:38am
.... what would happen if I refused to pay £500 of council tax ?
What would be the excuse used by the council in a court of law, that there is non payment of council tax ?
Just as a footnote:
Beware !
I overheard three councillors talking in Gt Yarmouth and it appears that Liebour councillors are going to use people to go round houses during the run up to the general election and try to gain a foothold in houses to spy on what people have in their houses, any 'hidden' improvements etc, thus charging them more council tax.
• Posted by: KarlH • Report Comment